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 Myozen Delport

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jamesiford

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PostSubject: Myozen Delport   Fri Jul 20, 2012 4:03 pm

First topic message reminder :

For those who trace their connections
back to the beginnings of the Zen Mission Society and the foundation of Shasta
Abbey I’m pleased as punch to say I’ve been in touch with Myozen Delport, for a
while Miyagawa.

Myozen was one of Kennett Roshi’s first students, studying with her at
Umpukuji. She ordained and was common in those years, not long after received
Dharma transmission on the 14th of July, 1969. She and another ordained
disciple came withher when the roshi came to California.

Following her marriage to Arnold, Myozen and her husband moved to his native
Canada. As was Kennett Roshi’s want, there were various false statements made about
her in the years that followed. Myozen has had a son, now grown, and following
a divorce has remarried.

What did happen is that she connected with an old friend, a Soto priest Kodo
Ito, and re-ordained with him. As Kennett Roshi never registered her
transmission there were no difficulties in her “starting over.” She travels to
Japan regularly. In 2004 Myozen received Dharma
transmission from Ito Roshi, which is registered in Japan.

This relationship continues to this day.


She is doing well.


And I am so glad.


I cannot say how important Myozen was to me at the beginning of my Zen life.
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mstrathern
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sun Sep 23, 2012 10:45 pm

Isan
I agree with you about the Buddha's visions but a careful look at the early scriptures shows that by and large the visions were mainly later, Mahayana accretions. It seems to me that the Mahayana took off and decided to treat Shakyamuni and his followers as a set of superheros. For instance I seem to remember one scripture that describes a sermon by the Buddha and says that in the middle he paused - for a couple of kalpas! Surely someone needed to pee in that time! Great stories, but stories that are trying to entertain and illustrate points. The problem is they tend to aggrandise all sorts of merely prosaic matters and are often taken for the literal truth. In ancient times the world was literally a magical place where all sorts of miraculous things happened. Today we know better. Just because some ancient thought the earth was flat does not mean we should believe it, but the central core of, at least Buddhist, religious teaching about the nature of our relationship to the truth still holds.
The questions that I find important in all this and need to be asked in regard to JK and the OBC concern three things: fact, intention, and outcomes. I'll explain what I mean and give my own personal views. Are the historical facts presented by JK true? Well, we know that she said that the facts in WWG had been changed so that it was a work of fiction but that is not how it is presented, and I can say that the visions and experiences of previous lives, both those of herself and others was presented to me as REAL. I am afraid I found, and find, that to be nonsense. I said at the time that to me they were makyo, delusions. JK did not tell me that I had got the wrong end of the stick and they were to not to be taken as reality instead she insisted on their literal truth. The second point is intention and here the water is very muddy. It seems that JK did at times have good intentions, however I feel that was often not true - look at the letters sent out about me, chisan and myozen. When I left I said that I thought what was happening was makyo and that not only did it in itself not lead to the truth but blocked the way for me. JK told me it was the literal truth and I felt that the intention was more to control than to enlighten me. Well, I'm afraid that I even more convinced it's nonsense now. The last and in may ways the most important and difficult to discern point is outcomes; are those in the OBC and those who come into contact with it better for their contact or worse. I can only say that personally I was blocked for many years, and from conversations and from what I have read here this seems to have been a common experience, indeed some would appear to have been actively damaged by their experiences with the OBC, and here I include present day monks and laity. The question must be is more harm than good done. I don't know I am not in a position to judge; but reading between the lines of the Faith Trust report they seem to portray a stultified inward looking organisation, more interested in its own future than the future of its members. Of course some will come through relatively unscathed and even benefit from the whole experience but my personal feeling is that over the years this is a small minority; and that from the evidence of the report and this forum many more were at the least blocked for some time, and some were actively damaged.


Last edited by mstrathern on Sun Sep 23, 2012 11:02 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Carol



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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sun Sep 23, 2012 10:52 pm

Michael said,

Quote :
For me Shasta was full of this interpretation and a stamping of feet,or
sending Josh to the goat shed if the interpretation was not adhered to.

Did I miss this? What is the story of sending Josh to the goat shed? What a bizarre way to treat another human being!
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chisanmichaelhughes



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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Mon Sep 24, 2012 1:45 am

Great reply Mark it seems that the practice was always done conceptuallywith pictures and images within their limited minds
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chisanmichaelhughes



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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Mon Sep 24, 2012 1:48 am

Carol at this point I would love to do a poem of The goat shed, Josh, somehow throw Todd in there and create a feel of banishment but is too early even for me!

Take care of yourself
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Kozan
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Mon Sep 24, 2012 2:32 am

The Goat Shed

My favorite place

The home of all beings.



(Thanks for the question Carol, and the inspiration Mike. And yes, I was once banished to the goat shed--by being placed in charge of the entire goat department!)
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chisanmichaelhughes

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Mon Sep 24, 2012 2:59 am

ah but only a Texan would have the entire department!
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Kozan
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Mon Sep 24, 2012 3:21 am

chisanmichaelhughes wrote:
ah but only a Texan would have the entire department!

Actually, in this case, the true, functional, head of the department was Rev. Rokuzan--who was astonishingly knowledgable about the needs and care of goats.

I was simply the nominal head of the department, installed by RMJK, because of my 'senority'. I followed Rokuzan's direction completely.

I believe that Rokuzan is from South Carolina, not Texas. ;-)
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chisanmichaelhughes

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Mon Sep 24, 2012 4:53 am

Josh Todd the Entire department

Banished forever

The state of constant meditation
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chisanmichaelhughes

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Mon Sep 24, 2012 5:23 am

loved your poem Kozan
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myozen

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Mon Sep 24, 2012 10:42 pm

Really enjoying the goat exchanges - it clears everything!

Chisan, I have been thinking about your comment regarding authoritarian aspects. It seems that not wanting to accept authority over/above her, Kennett Roshi also cut herself off from further personal study and deepening of experience through interaction with other teachers. It is also a matter of teachers learning from/through their disciples. If Kennett Roshi had continued her personal study/practice through such means there would have been vitality in her teachings and perhaps no need for fabrication or embellishment.

Mark, your comments struck me since this has been on my mind - I am probably about to state something that has long been obvious to everyone else. It was clear at Unpuku-ji already that Kennett Roshi very much loved the Denkoroku. In Chinese and Japanese Buddhism the transmission of stories relating to "miraculous monks" and visions were (they still are but I do not know how individual Japanese monks perceive these stories now) an important tradition, and often recounted as the basis for the founding of a particular temple or lineage. Often these stories provided more of a core than any specific teachings in the importance or significance of these personages. In our sanzen discussions at Unpuku-ji there was usually a strong mystical element in Kennett Roshi's approach. In relating her visions Kennett Roshi perhaps was making a statement of her own specialness and of reclaiming her divinity/spirituality within the same context?

We also have autumn showers today. While most of the plants are shutting down, the squash are still showing bright yellow flowers in the rain.

Gassho,

Myozen
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Jcbaran

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Mon Sep 24, 2012 11:25 pm

Something to point out. Kennett demanded her students totally surrender to her -- but this is something that she never did herself. Koho Zenji was a distant teacher and she cut herself off from Yogo when things didn't go perfectly. She was Yogo's disciple -- for awhile, but terminated the relationship totally, completely as soon as she could. She was the boss. She would submit herself to no one. Yet she demanded total adoration and devotion and obedience. But she never, ever did that. What do you call that kind of behavior?

Back to the Denkoroku. The Denkoroku are stories. Just that. They are not history. They are poetic expressions, but fables. And as we know now, and in fact, the Zen historians in Japan knew this in the 1960s, the lineages traced to the Buddha were all fabricated, invented in ninth century China.

Part of loving these tales of "unbroken transmission" is that it put Kennett (or any Zen teacher who cherishes these tales) in that position of being a patriarch, of being in that lineage, of being the same as Shakyamuni or Dogen. You tell these stories about these patriarchs, but you are really talking about yourself indirectly or implicitly. It is a strong enchantment. You get stoned telling these stories. But they are not fact, but religious fiction designed to establish traditions and sects and political authority in some cases. These stories were written and rewritten to serve all kinds of cultural and political factions in China for centuries - and mostly these tales had little to do with training or meditation.
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chisanmichaelhughes

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Tue Sep 25, 2012 2:55 pm

Interesting points.


I am sort of reminded of Bill Picard's diary. After world war 2 Bill was recovering from an illness he picked up during the war. He spent time in northern India recovering, and met a Buddhist monk who was a disciple of Hsu Yun. Hsu Yun was a descendant of all 5 Chan schools,so meeting a disciple was a rare opportunity. The monk did give Bill some basic meditation instruction,but he did refused further contact, and the request from Bill to be a disciple himself,only dismissing Bill with the words find your East in the West.


When Bill returned to the UK still with the aftermath of his illness he dreamt of the Chinese monk and dreamt he was standing in some water beconing him to follow.When Bill a few weeks later travelled to Cornwall he recognised the water as Mounts Bay near Mousehole fishing Village.


Well a nice story and well written in Bills Diary. After Bill died some of his friends studied this part of the diary over and over again,so they did not miss anything,so they did not miss a secret teaching,maybe hoping that a few words of text would bypass the life time of practice that realization demands.


I think this discussion of the Denkoroku reminds me of this,sometimes I think the greater sounding the words, the wilder the practice, the constant talk of great experiences,the more structure, the greater the need for authority and control,the wiser one pretends to be,the more one demands to be a teacher... the further away one is, from ones heart
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Carol

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Wed Sep 26, 2012 11:50 pm

I am reminded of a scene at Mahabodhi Temple at Bodhgaya, the supposed site of the Buddha's enlightenment. According to the myth, five shafts of light shot out from the Buddha's body after he was enlightened. So someone constructed this neon thing not far from the Temple that shoots five neon strips in garish colors in the five directions. This thing stands off to the side so you can't miss it. The neon thing looks one of the garish signs on the Las Vegas Strip. But hey, it LITERALLY follows the myth, so who's to say???
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myozen

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Thu Sep 27, 2012 11:20 pm

Hello Josh and Chisan, your comments are very interesting and thought-inspiring. Jotted down a few thoughts.

Carol, I really enjoyed your Mahabodhi Temple story and had a chuckle visualizing it!

I have a bit of a 'flu at present so would like to write tomorrow.

Gassho,
Myozen
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chisanmichaelhughes

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Fri Sep 28, 2012 1:39 am

I thought I may help out with a traditional Native Indian flu remedy I am marketing for an old friend
It is
Ye Olde Annes Flu Remedy
follow the following steps
1 Find brown bear either by laying bait in back yard or
2 Hunting in any nearby forests
3 Rivers are an excellent place to start as all bears stock up on food for the winter
4 When bear is located find the Brown Bear Tick found at the nape of its neck
5 This tick will have to be fried with canned fish oil
6 The difficult part is sneaking up behind the bear.. suggest do it when it is asleep
7 When the bear pounces on you run as fast as you can
8 There are 3 rules when being chased by brown bears
8.1 Run fast
8.2 Do not climb trees
8.3 Don't try and be smart and talk to the bear
If still alive after long chase the flu will have been sweated out
Also if the flu has reached a point of weird dreams and nightmares let me know as I have another remedy for that
It is
Ye Olde Annes natural nasal spray reality restorer
failing all of that just get well soon
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mstrathern
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Fri Sep 28, 2012 7:45 pm

Myozen
Sorry to here about the flu, hope it clears up quickly.
Whilst Chisan's remedy is excellent empirical studies have shown that a grizzly is better than a brown bear, they run faster and you therefore work up a better sweat. They also have a louder roar which I believe helps with the sweat too.
If you do find your grizzly, I am told that smearing yourself all over with grizzly fat and then then wrapping yourself up well and sitting by a big fire is a sovereign remedy (though you may find you're sleeping on you own for a few days)
In any case, all the best and here's to a quick recovery,
Mark
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Anne

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sat Sep 29, 2012 9:01 am

:-) Here is a traditional poem to go with the above traditional remedies...

Algie met a bear,
The bear met Algie,
The bear was bulgy,
The bulge was Algie.
Here are some other traditional approaches...

...just make sure you're the one with the remote...

...yoga asanas may be helpful...

...when all else fails.

Here's wishing you the best, Myozen (-:
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myozen

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sun Sep 30, 2012 12:19 am

Chisan and Mark,
Thank you for the most excellent remedies - I have filed it safely for future reference. I have a question - what do I do in winter when the bears are hibernating?

Anne,
Thank you for providing the answer to my question above - I will look at the pictures and emulate the bears!

Seriously, your messages have cheered me up so much!

Here is a cold remedy Perry's mother presented me with when I first moved to the village: swallow a tablespoon full of oolichan grease mixed with Vicks VapoRub ... would one call this "fusion" medicine?

Thank you again and also take care of yourselves as winter approaches.

Gassho :-)
Myozen
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Jcbaran

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sun Sep 30, 2012 3:49 pm

i don't think they have any "oolichan grease" at my local manhattan pharmacy, but they do have Vicks Vapor Rub, but not sure you should be swallowing that.
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myozen

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sun Sep 30, 2012 7:57 pm

Josh, it seems oolichan grease is in short supply everywhere!

That combination of ingredients was an interesting experience ... one is certainly there in the moment for this!
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Howard

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sun Sep 30, 2012 11:48 pm



I believe Camphor (Vick's active ingredient) is not even supposed to be put near open wounds because it's considered to be toxic inside the human body in any state other than a vapour.

The bear/flu suffering therapy does work though. I can attest that a bears tongue on ones scalp fosters a mind completely oblivious to all health concerns except those relevant to that interaction.

Given a choice though, I'd be quaffing the Vick's without a second thought.
Myozen

Last year in Sept between Cape Scott and Cape Sutil we paddled for a mile through a huge school of 5" fish. We've seen many herring balls before but this eclipsed in size anything we'd experienced before. Greys, Humpback, Orca and sea Lions were passing by each other in a feeding frenzy. "Herring" fins splashed like rain drops on the surface of the sea until we exited the area.. You've written before about Oolichan shortages and it made me wonder how or if one visually tells the difference between herring and Oolichan at sea.

(I don't know if what we saw was herring)
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chisanmichaelhughes

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Mon Oct 01, 2012 4:41 am

tried to edit
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Anne

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Mon Oct 01, 2012 9:44 am

:-) Myozen, I had a very quick look on the internet about ingesting Vicks Vapor Rub. It seems someone's aunt had a similar suggestion to your ma-in-law's; but reportedly, though ingesting it to break up phlegm -- let's hear it for reality! -- was once common, ingredients have since changed and it's not now considered safe...
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20071027055924AAifxzs
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myozen

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Tue Oct 02, 2012 12:31 am

Howard,
I tend to agree with you on reaching for the Vicks rather than the bear close-up treatment.

I asked Perry about the visual identification of oolichan/herring and he responded - "It would be difficult to tell the difference at sea, but oolichans travel in very large schools, so perhaps that would account for the size of the ball. Perhaps that is where all our oolichans are! This is why we traditionally used the funnel net to catch them for making grease - we harvest them in the river, not the ocean. Oolichans are slimmer than herring and the male oolichan has rougher skin to the touch and a dull sheen, while the female oolichan have smooth skin and a rainbow sheen. In the water in a school they appear black. One year when I was coming back from Klemtu in the fall, around September, I could smell oolichans. There are still oolichans up the Nass, but they travel a different route to the oolichans around Kitamaat. There used to be an oolichan camp near the village - we could just take the canoes to the slough there. After Eurocan came, we set up camp at Kildala but eventually pollution there also affected the oolichan run. There are no oolichans around Kemano now either, where we used to go after Kildala was spoiled. The gates at the Alcan power plant dam at Kemano are periodically opened to let water out into the river, causing a change in the course. I think that this opening of the gates was timed poorly one year and washed the eggs away during the oolichan spawning season. Another reason is the bottom trawlers."

Have you been up this way, Howard? A bit of a storm passed through and the Skeena River looks like hot chocolate today.


Anne,
Thank you for checking! It was in 1984 that the Vicks-oolichan grease remedy was in use, so hopefully this was before the new ingredients?

Kennett Roshi's remedy for a cold I caught shortly after ordination was hot brandy. Kennett Roshi, Mokurai and I were sitting under the kotatsu, this being in February, and the hot brandy knocked me right out. When I woke up later, having fallen asleep on the floor with legs still under the kotatsu, there was an important guest present - the abbot of a large temple in Tsu city, who had come to meet Kennett Roshi's two new students. He was gracious, saying that when one is sick one should act sick.

Gassho,
Myozen
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chisanmichaelhughes

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Tue Oct 02, 2012 2:04 am

Another fishy story is the reapearance of Genpo Roshi doing a big mind retreat.
What is interesing is tha he did not seem to heed the advice of his peers.In the biography of him on the retreat details, there is a very good Josh story of how a great image of himself is formed for others to view.
I feel there is a certain brazenness about it, there is a feel for me of ...go for it, have the guts to cut through other peoples criticism,use the dynamics of lessons lernt in a zendo to see the emptyness of other peoples criticism.
The story follows the same lines studying wih Maezumi Roshi being given inca to teach passing on inca to teach to 12 people,but actually forgetting the words; what he has learnt and taught is how he has lived.

Interesting is he had an awakening before meeting Maezumi and he lived in a hut for a year on his own.I always find the hairs stand up on mmy back when people talk about awakenings like this. However hopefully everyone experiences meaningful moments in their lives that may well be accompanied by some insight,I remember standing on a hill years ago and looking at an incredible view of vast countryside,I could also see clearly that my problems were although important to me were tiny and not a physical part of the huge perspective.We all experience things like this,simple and personal very helpful,but infering anything else is purely adding to the elaboration of our self or story.
For me interestingly reading about Genpo reminded me of a visit I had from someone who had stayed at LAZC,the experience of staying there had made him a lot more confident as a person and given him the ability to speak out for himself.He told me that he had met a girl there and she lived 50 miles away,they got on well and my friend asked if he could visit her sometime .she said ok. With his new found confidence he decided to speak out and be direct.So he said he did not want a relationship or friendship, he only wanted to visit to have a weekend of sex and could her young kids go stay with her mom..The girl agreed...ah the power of being direct
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Tue Oct 02, 2012 4:16 am

There's enough room in this Big Mind


For


My personal views of the Universe
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Anne

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Tue Oct 02, 2012 6:23 am

:-) Jhānic experiences can be very illuminating. They not only accompany liberative insight into śūnyatā but may also precipitate it, or they may be illuminating to the experient in other ways. But I'm a bit concerned that there may be public confusion between jhānic/samādhic 'oneness' experience, where the person has had no direct insight into not-self but which may be a prelude toward the latter in due course, and actual liberative seeing into not-self. Thoughts are garbled...it's shopping day! CMH, I will send over some of Ye Olde Anne's WondeRub that also doubles (or is it quintuples?) as an insect-repellent, anti-itch gel, embalming-fluid and furniture-restorer. (-:
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chisanmichaelhughes

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Tue Oct 02, 2012 8:46 am

Well that explains it..I thought that the last consignment of Ye Olde Anne's WondeRub said WonderRum on the bottle I did have some sort of Jhanic and samadhic experience,and also for two weeks after was never 3 metres from my bathroom.

My current order of Dorset cottage cheese made with your curdled sheeps milk has not arrived but I see the cheques already been banked
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Tue Oct 02, 2012 11:52 am

You`re lucky,

I`ve still not come down from her transcendal home grown `smoking herb`
mixture.

Had to pay cash only for that !
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Tue Oct 02, 2012 8:07 pm

Myozen

Thanks for the oolichan info.

There are few roller coasters as challenging as Hecat Straight in a storm. We've had some interesting paddles on the Haida Gwaii side of it across from you. We have not tried your side of it but some of the Islands NW of you look like interesting kayaking possibilities.

Best success with the winter food gathering.

H
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myozen

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Wed Oct 03, 2012 1:17 pm

Chisan and Anne,
Fresh oolichan grease would have the same effect as Ye Olde Anne's WonderRum ...

I came from bear posture number 3 to post previous messages, and since I was ambulatory I went back to the notes about material from Kennett Roshi via Suigan Yogo which I had started in 2003 and had set aside. So yesterday morning I woke up from a dream in which Kennett Roshi looks the way she did when I first met her - in the dream she is in Unpuku-ji (and not oolichan camp). She is preparing to leave Unpuku-ji and is happy because she was to be married. She has me sorting her things and I find the template for a gorin no to (5-ringed stupa representing the 5 elements/the body, etc) on orange paper. The empty space on the template shows the shape of the stupa. Since I sometimes draw my dreams, I went to the craft store and purchased orange paper to make the stupa template. As I cut the stupa shape out of paper to produce the empty space, of course I had the solid shape result from this - a sort of complementary positive/negative yin/yang pair. It occurred to me that this image had to do with Dharma transmission between teacher and student. I thought about your comments regarding Genpo Roshi, Chisan - it is difficult to fathom how teachers can conscience the abuse of students/power. Such abuse tantamounts to the abuse of the dharma.


Howard,
When I relayed your comments to Perry he commiserated and then told the story of his experience of being caught in a storm in the Hecate Straight. He was on a seine boat and said that when the boat was in the well of the waves, the lights of the other boats could not be seen.

Have you seen the film "The Pipedreams Project" - three kayakers who paddled the proposed Enbridge tanker route (right through Haisla food gathering territory) in 2010? David Suzuki was present at one of the rallies in Kitamaat Village where this was discussed but I have not seen the film. Please come to explore the Douglas Channel by kayak some time.

Gassho,
Myozen
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Wed Oct 03, 2012 4:12 pm

Myozen I have sent over via Paypal 25uk£ for a jar (small) of fresh oolichan grease please change label to organic body lotion and send (surface mail) with Happy Christmas message to our friend in Dorset UK It may not produce a Samadic experience,but will create the right atmosphere for solitary meditation.

Well an Interesting dream and with it our usual question pops up, What is passd on

Is the truth beyond words ..no words
Is the truth beyond Buddhism..no Buddhism
In all the places I have been and travelled I have never seen anything labelled Buddha Mind
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myozen

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Fri Oct 05, 2012 12:43 am

Chisan,
Oh, now I am in trouble! :-)
Perry has reminded me that fresh oolichan grease always comes with moss.

At a very basic level, in the sense of conventional/relative truth, copying the transmission documents brought it so vibrantly home to me that many generations of ordinary monks like myself have written, and heard, the same words "contained" in denbo. "That" which is transmitted is intangible and cannot be defined and has nothing to do with whether the lineage is fabricated or has gaps - as you say, no words, no Buddhism, no-thing that is labelled "Buddha mind".

Please dismiss the above as being the result of a long day with meetings, doctor's appointments!

It was 3 degrees celsius when we left home this morning. Beautiful colours on the mountains - hope you are enjoying early Autumn.

Gassho,
Myozen
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Fri Oct 05, 2012 1:59 am

Myozen,and all, I've enjoyed reading the exchanges and posts on the oolichan remedies, the theme of Autumn running through the posts and along with it the gathering, getting ready for winter activities. Various thoughts come up on those subjects, and also good to know that many of the Native Americans still live close to the old traditional ways, at least as much as this is possible Also, allthough it doesn't compare to the feats of daring such as Howards Kayak trips in the Hecate Straights I had to recall crossing the Haslam Creek suspension bridge, at Nanaimo,B.C. in the seventies, the farthest north, at least on the west coast I've ever been to. It was at that time a very "basic" suspension bridge made out of ropes and logs, (with a few logs missing) and by the time you got to the middle it swayed a lot, and there was that creek down below.(way way below) I finallythought of looking it up on line and saw that it has been replaced by what looks like a very modern "safe" steel contraption, certainly much safer but a bit out of sync with the surrounding environment compared to the original ropes and logs bridge..
And to Chisan M.H., that Poetry is pretty good, (loved the one about Josh jumping into the slime),
Autumn, here in Southern California, is often accompanied by a late blast of heat and vegetation begging for water. At times enormous cumulus clouds rise from behind the local mountains, occasionally causing flash flooding there before being quickly absorbed back into the porous ground. Down here on the coast any rain would be extremely rare and usually waits until winter. We know that Autumn is here when piles of Pumpkins start showing up everywhere and Starbucks serves up , spicy Pumpkin Lattes, in spite of the heat.

In Gassho

Brigitte
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Anne

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Fri Oct 05, 2012 5:40 am

:-) Chisan, I can tell you’re mad about the missing cheese. Unfortunately the centrifuge for curdling the sheep is broken…I have also had a visit from the RSPCA but your cheque has bought silence for the time being. I will make it up to you. (-:

:-) Hi Myozen!

Now that we have cranked you to your feet, I hope you don’t mind my asking further about the sad tangle of your correspondence with Kennett Roshi...I am not trying to send you back to your sick-bed — honest! So please take your time...and only when you’re feeling up to it.

In your post on September 21 (http://obcconnect.forumotion.net/t537p200-myozen-delport#9309) you wrote something of the reply you made to her (?in 1974) about the draft-copies she had sent on “Muriel”…
Quote :
Shuffling through the bundle I did find a handwritten draft of my reply to her (this bundle had been kept wrapped up for so many years that I had forgotten some of the content) I do not know for certain if I made some changes to the wording in the actual letter, but I wrote in the letter draft that there are matters which one may openly discuss with a trusted acquaintance and which one expects would remain with this person and that although I feel hesitant to do so, I feel I have to state that these passages appear to be such misrepresentations of facts that they have little resemblance to the actual events. I wrote to her that upon reading sections of my own diary covering the same period, it is very striking to compare her view of me and my own inner life at the time and that I wished to believe that these entries of hers were written up later for the purpose of teaching me something.
If you can remember about that time, did you believe that she knew the reality but for some reason had misrepresented you deliberately? Was it some time after leaving Kennett Roshi, and perhaps looking back and wondering what the hot-and-nasty-place had happened, that you connected some of her beliefs and behaviours toward you in Japan to what she had written about “Muriel” in her draft?

From recalling my own beliefs in the 1970s, I wonder if it may not be unusual to believe that ones teacher always really does understand or know what is going on with oneself at a deep level: so that when they speak or behave in ways that seem otherwise, one thinks this must be for some other reason, despite the bizarre sense of dissonance between the outer world of what they actually say and do and ones belief that they know the truth of a particular matter. The sense of mind/energy-connectedness that develops through meditation and the mind-and-heart nature of ongoing practice, and perhaps a hope for a guide who knows and understands one absolutely and a belief that finding such a guide is possible, may be factors on ones own side that contribute…plus the facts that they may demonstrate deep intuitiveness about certain matters concerning oneself, and that general aspects of the teaching prove remarkably true to oneself. Even when the misunderstandings become more obvious and one faces the collapse of the fairytale, that too can seem surreal, incredible, shocking, tragic, devastating…mind you, when I thought about how wrong and unknowing I could be and had been it helped my perspective considerably! But when one looks back, it all seems such a shame that the misunderstandings between oneself and the other person occurred.

In your post on September 19 (http://obcconnect.forumotion.net/t537p200-myozen-delport#9285) you quoted Kennett Roshi…
Quote :
On April 23rd, 1974 she sent me the draft sections with a letter stating, "I must confess I am deeply surprised that our relations have degenerated so far that you cannot trust me in this matter. All others whom I have written to have so far done so. I can only presume the special relationship that you have always said was between us is now lost due to your marriage. The master-disciple relationship is based on trust. I did not think that I would have to ever point this out to you. P.S. If you really feel badly about the publication of any of this I can cut you out of my book completely; if this is what you prefer." I requested her to leave me out of her book, and this resulted in the severing of ties with her.
Despite the intended tactfulness of your reply, I wonder if she might have received your comments as accusation or insinuation that she had intentionally misrepresented you… Having believed that your wish to see what she had written for WWG indicated a degeneration in your relationship, might she have construed your reply as more of the same?…Aaargh!… As Chisan wrote, your request to see it before it was published seemed very reasonable; it's a shame that (from some basis poignantly affecting to her, if opaque or hazy to me) she construed this as mistrust of her.

Even trying to live preceptually, life can be like a sequence out of Dynasty...
...(minus fame-and-gain motives, of course…and maybe also without the gorgeous country setting and opulence! sigh), where misunderstandings and conclusions drawn lead from one drama/tragedy to another.…

In the above quote, you mentioned that requesting Kennett Roshi to omit you from the book resulted in severing ties with her. In response to my asking if you formally severed ties in the same letter as your request, in your post on September 23 (http://obcconnect.forumotion.net/t537p200-myozen-delport#9325) you wrote…
Quote :
Before going back to Japan in 1976 I wrote to Kennett Roshi in early September requesting a formal letter of release, but she did not respond to this. In subsequent letters from her and Daizui they indicated that correspondence with us was being terminated. After the whole business of the interference once we were in Japan and I had done genzoku, I also wrote to her in April 1979 that I am totally severing all connections with her and her organisation.
I may have misunderstood but was there a one-to-two year gap between your letter requesting to be omitted from WWG and the above-mentioned 1976 request for release, during which you and Arnold were officially still priests within the Zen Mission Society/ Reformed Soto Zen Church? If so, what was your general communication with Kennett Roshi like during that period, before you and Arnold left in 1976?

On August 20 (http://obcconnect.forumotion.net/t537p100-myozen-delport#8963) you wrote…
Quote :
The person to whom I was married at Shasta Abbey, Arnold, and I went to Canada to work and save money for the required fees at Shasta Abbey; however, when we were ready to return to the abbey, we were informed that married couples were no longer allowed. This resulted in our move to Japan to practice there …
Was the bar on married couples effectively the ‘last straw’ for you both? Would you have stayed (assuming that no worse ructions occurred in future) had it not been for this change in policy on married couples?

Thank you for bearing with me, Myozen! You may breathe a sigh of relief now as I shall go and poke my nose in something else! (^: :-) Chisan…manners! (-:
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chisanmichaelhughes

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Fri Oct 05, 2012 7:22 am

yes I remember the slime Brigitte it was of course refering to that particular teaching,and I must apologise my my incessant rudeness to Anne and poetry that always puts Josh in the goat house I wont do it again...today!
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Fri Oct 05, 2012 10:29 am

myozen wrote:
"That" which is transmitted is intangible and cannot be defined and has nothing to do with whether the lineage is fabricated or has gaps - as you say, no words, no Buddhism, no-thing that is labelled "Buddha mind".

Myozen, this captures the essence so well. How could there be gaps in the lineage? If it appears broken it can only be because there are times when we cannot trace it.
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sat Oct 06, 2012 11:45 am

:-) Hi Myozen!

I've realised that I added to your labours when asking if you would have stayed in the Order had it not been for the change in policy on married couples, as you'd already said as much elsewhere (http://obcconnect.forumotion.net/t537p50-myozen-delport#8841)...
Quote :
Leaving Shasta Abbey had not been Arnold and my idea - although I had not been paying the fees due to translation work I was doing, after marriage to Arnold she required that he pay for both of us. We went to Vancouver to work and save for the fees but when we were ready to return she first informed us that the Abbey was full and then that married couples were no longer allowed.
I think there were still married couples in the Abbey at that time... Does anyone know if entry/re-entry for married couples was stopped in general during 1976 (i.e other than just for Myozen and Arnold)? Or if the Abbey did get rather full? (Perhaps Kennett Roshi wanted to limit numbers at the time of her illness?)
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sat Oct 06, 2012 12:07 pm

Anne wrote:
I think there were still married couples in the Abbey at that time... Does anyone know if entry/re-entry for married couples was stopped in general during 1976 (i.e other than just for Myozen and Arnold)? Or if the Abbey did get rather full? (Perhaps Kennett Roshi wanted to limit numbers at the time of her illness?)

Yes, there were ordained married couples living at the Abbey in 76, but they were expected to train there as if single and had limited accomodations. I can't remember when the new Zendo was built as it did alleviate the space shortage, however there was also Kannon Dell for married monks and laypeople. I don't believe a lack of space was a serious reason to deny Myozen and Arnold coming back. I don't remember there being a more general policy in place to restrict numbers, but perhaps others can remember more?
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sat Oct 06, 2012 1:27 pm

I think the issue is how Myozen or anyone else was made to feel. I think Myozen was made to feel unwanted ,rejected and maybe that she had done something wrong..this is called manipulaion not Zen Buddhism

A great misunderstanding of Zen is that bendowa or living a meditative life is selfless and cold.

With lack of experience and misunderstanding it can be very easily be thought that zen is cold, especially if self denial runs through the teaching and pactice. It can be assumed that zen training is about denying the self, denying its existance. The story of Kinzan,or Henry is an example of this. What was that about,why do that to Kinzan what purpose did it serve,what was taught and what was learnt. When one has to be beastly to try to teach simple things it is all flawed. Sodos i have been to in Japan were very difficult and tough,certainly pushed me to limits,simple things like always sitting and kneeling on the floor is quite hard going ,I have been picked up off the floor quite a few times, but it was never cold hearted. The core of Zen is compassion and love, any understanding without compassion and love is practice without direction,it becomes a means of controling the people
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Anne

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sat Oct 06, 2012 4:00 pm

:-) Thank you, Isan...probably I should have done something more like this :-(

I doubt that Kennett Roshi would have written the defamatory falsifying letters out of personal vanity...but maybe from concern that some unwelcome practical outcome or chain of events might result from Myozen's registering a change of teacher? Inevitably this is all very speculative but, say, had she wanted to prevent Myozen and Arnold's return to Shasta Abbey -- not that they had done something wrong but that she had lost trust in them and just didn't want them around -- with the reality of Myozen registering her change of teacher in 1978 at Soto HQ, could there be a 'practical reason' why Kennett Roshi might wish to disguise the real circumstances of their departure?...that she had said "no room at the inn" and that was that. A litany of historical fiction might disguise the reality (though including a too-long-deceased Zen teacher might overstretch the reader's imagination) and, by discrediting Myozen, perhaps ensure that it remained disguised. (I might be drafting a historical fiction of my own here.)

I am glad, Myozen, that Kennett Roshi's Japanese friend saw fit to let you know what was being written of you. Actually, I seem to remember that Kennett Roshi wrote somewhere that it was the 'done thing' in Zen temples to do just that. I wonder what he thought of it all?!

My sympathies, again, to you...
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sat Oct 06, 2012 4:59 pm

there are so many stories of discrediting and controlling other people one sometimes forgets that there was some good things that attracte dus in the first place.However one should be attracted to the great way not someones individual message.

This reminds me of 1970 after the second retreat at Sarum House I stayed on and met many friends from many organisations,even then Jiyu kennett had got some peoples backs up, I remember someone asking Sangharashita of his opinion of JK and her going on about the Buddhist Society he said she ought to just drop it,there was a group nod but she developed this other side which was not so apparent to all of us in the early days
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sat Oct 06, 2012 9:14 pm

From my experience, as i have said before, Kennett often was vindictive, vengeful. Sure, we can dress this up or give her the benefit of the doubt, but in retrospect, that's what I saw going on. Her behavior wasn't for anyone's good. It was about her being in total control and keeping people spiritual children.

This kind of leadership / behavior is very common in the world, in religious organizations, in politics, in the corporate world, in academia. This boss mentality - there is no surprise here. How could this be? well, it be... commonly. I have seen many gurus behave in even more vengeful ways when their disciples assert their own adulthood, dare to disagree, or try to be even a little independent. There is nothing surprising here. There are always rationalizations and mitigating circumstances and excuses about why the guru treats people badly (mostly based on the various myths of "everything that he/she does is great teaching - the big myth/story), but this quacking is a duck and this behavior is vindictive. Mostly unconscious, but that is no excuse, No free pass here. She was accountable. Gurus are accountable. If enlightened activity leaves no wake, then clearly so much unenlightened activity.
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sun Oct 07, 2012 5:06 am

:-) In another wild-but-hopefully-not-libellous theory, maybe Kennett Roshi learned from SotoShu of Myozen's registering a change of teacher: SotoShu wanted to do the admin and contacted her, and uhoh uhoh she had to reply. (Also, if Myozen explained to SotoShu, when registering the change, that she wrote to Kennett Roshi but had heard nothing back etc, might this have been conveyed in the hypothetical 'letter' from SotoShu to KR?)

I have no wbhnl theory why a simple "apologies, it was an oversight" wouldn't do as reply, and none why it might matter so much to Kennett Roshi to appear to SotoShu as impeccably keeping their protocols. Even so, her aggressive methods of asserting her view and of controlling activities may not necessarily mean that she relished aggression as such (man, what a high!), or revenge for its own sake...

If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it could also be a decoy...but someone may still be shooting at you from the bulrushes... (-:
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sun Oct 07, 2012 7:29 am

It seems Anne that you are doing a brilliant Anne type job in righting the world,and making everything ok,which is a great Anne type Asset

Making it all sound that everything is ok,and any possible human unsuspecting nastiness can be excused by a clerical error. We do not want to see the people we have put on pedestals actually not be the saints we thought they were,especially the people we sought spiritual direction from.

How many kids in the UK have been brought up with Jimmy Saville (British TV entertainer recently died),and today the Prime Minister has asked for an enquiry into his behavior with young children and the increasing story of well known entertainers within the BBC possibly being apart of it,and everyone turned a blind eye,or dissmissed it with 'we get lots of young girls chasing us'
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sun Oct 07, 2012 7:58 am

ZEN DYNASTY
...Nemo Roshi receives a letter from SotoShu...
Quote :
Dear Nemo Roshi, We hope you are well and that your arthritis is not playing up. By the way, we have received an application from Ms X to register with another teacher. We understand that she has notified you of her departure from your organisation. The cherry blossoms are looking lovely at present and the geese are flying south for the winter...
Nemo Roshi suspects that this is but the tip of an iceberg of a move to discredit her and to poach unwanted disciples, and so decides to go hyperbolic...
Quote :
Dear SotoShu, I hope you are well and that your mother has recovered from that infected strawberry cheesecake. You should know that the applicant, Ms X, was dismissed from all 1004 temples of our Order, and is wanted in 1005 federal states on 1006 counts of causing grievous bodily harm, 1007 counts of stealing donuts from the canteen, 1008 counts of snoring during vespers...[Nemo Roshi extemporises creatively]... From my window, the breath-taking colours of autumn cover the mountains, and the bluebells are looking lovely too...
...There, that ought to do it!...
drunken
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sun Oct 07, 2012 8:57 am

Dearest Dorset

Despite the fact that the cottage cheese money was used for other purposes,the continued use of organic black eyed beans is giving me major 'sitting'problems, and also because I cant read your long words nor understand what you are trying to say. The arrival of the cherry blossoms in spring always reminds me that the universe is whole and perfection itself, and misappropriate behaviour is only seen by the dualistic minds of the unenlightened
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sun Oct 07, 2012 9:20 am

:-) Dearest Cornwall, I hope your rectal discomfort will soon pass.

Where exactly did it sound as if everything was OK, CMH? That certainly wasn't my intention.

I realise that to explain some of JK's behaviours, some people believe that it must be due to spiritual apostasy, and/or to illusoryself-grasping and attachment to kleśas...I think JK may have had a similar belief when the behaviour of some her senior students did not comply with her expectations or beliefs, as I wonder why else she would go at them like crazy. She seems to have developed that view of Suigan Yogo also, just as some may have it of her. The person is perceived as having turned away wilfully or lazily from what is perceived as 'the right path'.

My view is that even a person who has abandoned gross and subtle illusoryself-grasping, and is not attached to the kleśas, may speak and act as if waging war or laying down law due to their beliefs (including beliefs about 'appropriate action')...this is not a whimsical idea of mine but one drawn redface from experience. You may think me quite nice now (or not, as the case may be) ...but... rendeer

I don't know about Jim's spiritual life, whether he tried to practise the Noble Eightfold Path in daily life (in which samadhi can be kśanika-samādhi, moment-by-moment samadhi), but I doubt that JK would have seen any advantage to herself in trying to deceive herself or turn aside from that. One of the reasons that people do this is fear of being worthy of destruction...one might say not realising compassion, at a deep level, for themselves. I don't think this was the case with JK...I think she had trained and understood beyond that...but I am not saying that everything was fine as it was. It may be difficult to tell what motivates someone; but with her senior students, and others whose training she recognised as having some degree of insight liberating them from illusoryself-view/grasping, I think it would have been better for all concerned if she had continued to trust in their basic intentions...that whatever they were mystifyingly and displeasingly saying or doing was due to more elusive factors than spiritual apostasy or a path of deliberate self-deception. I must eat now and phone Auntie, but not necessarily in that order. (-:
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sun Oct 07, 2012 9:49 am

I think alot of these issues and problems stem from basic and initial approach.

one starts ,not sure what to do asks advice ..seeks help, and straight away the relationship master desciple develops. The illusion is that this might well suit the master more than the desciple. Buddhism can be taught quite well in a school room or university, the posture and some breathing techniques can be shown or taught. Realization of original nature can not be taught or squeezed out of anyone.the delusion that one needs a teacher should be dispelled as soon as possible by a teacher.

The communial practice of meditation,the strength and joint discipline of a temple is something else it is done together led from the top all together. A good teacher is very much a follower of the way as anyone else, never a person who has achieved anything,and certainly a person whom would learn from everybody there even new recruits.

these issues that you rightly bring up are for me issues and should not be dressed up or confused with teaching
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sun Oct 07, 2012 10:18 am

Jcbaran wrote:
From my experience, as i have said before, Kennett often was vindictive, vengeful. Sure, we can dress this up or give her the benefit of the doubt, but in retrospect, that's what I saw going on. Her behavior wasn't for anyone's good. It was about her being in total control and keeping people spiritual children.

One reason why you and I remember JK differently is because she in fact treated us differently. I was younger and less mature than you when I arrived at Shasta Abbey. I had had a difficult relationship with my mother which was something JK understood from personal experience. She was nurturing toward me sometimes - she was capable of empathy. I don't think you needed that kind of support and so didn't elicit those feelings from her. In the end I couldn't bare her behavior for all the same reasons you couldn't, but now the memory of my positive experiences mitigates my negative feelings somewhat.

Have you ever considered how the work you did in "Sorting It Out" may have impacted you? You worked with many injured people who I imagine had really terrible things to say about their former teachers/groups. You heard the worst of the worst and I wonder sometimes if that has further darkened your memories of JK and Shasta Abbey?
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sun Oct 07, 2012 3:52 pm

Brigitte,
I enjoyed your account of crossing the suspension bridge at Nanaimo. At the Indian village up here, Gitwinksihlkw - which is surrounded by lava beds in the Nass Valley - there is an old suspension bridge which used to be the only access by foot to and from the community until motor vehicle access road was completed in 1995. Next time we find ourselves there, we will perhaps try to cross it and let you know how we fared?


Anne,
At the time I read the WWG draft sections Kennett Roshi sent me, the impression was that she had composed these as a form of castigation since I had requested to see the sections prior to publication - these sections did not bear much truth to events or to myself. In the letter I sent to her in response I made a statement to this effect, and also stated that I wished to believe - this also meant "wished to be able to" - that she had done this for the purpose of teaching (since the alternative would be that she was deliberately being destructive). The tenor of these statements were similar in vein to the accusations at Unpuku-ji already. One such incident took place when Kennett Roshi was gradually separating me from some activities in Unpuku-ji - putting me in with the "Japanese contingency" - my Japanese dharma brother and I were sometimes left to our own devices, so we did zazen together, went on takuhatsu together, attempting to maintain a sodo life - with the result that Kennett Roshi accused me of misleading him. I was soundly reprimanded for helping an elderly lady weed the cemetery on a very hot day - she pointed out that there was a memorial there for fallen Japanese WW2 soldiers (members of the parish.) Be that as it may, in my experience Kennett Roshi was not a person with whom one can reason once she had made up her mind about something. I had transgressed by requesting to see the sections, and that was that.

Anne, I do not like confrontation and discord, so it is difficult to write candidly about this without the matter of disharmony in the sangha presenting itself. I feel that I should re-state that I am grateful to her for ordaining me in the first place - I feel she was sincere in her acceptance of me as her student and there were also positive qualities in the experiences with her which have remained with me after all these years.

In 1971-1972 Arnold and I were working in Vancouver to save money for fees to return to Shasta Abbey and were ready to do so when Kennett Roshi informed us first that the Abbey was full, and then that married couples were no longer allowed. If she had not informed us of this, we would have returned since that was the reason for the employment in Vancouver. I do not think this was necessarily aimed at us personally, since it seems she had decided that all Shasta Abbey members were henceforth to be celibate like her. We subsequently moved up north to the Hazelton area, where I continued doing translations for Kennett Roshi (I was translating another book by Koho Zenji and also her personal correspondence). The correspondence exchanged between us was congenial at the time until the matter of the WWG draft sections.

After having written to Kennett Roshi requesting a formal letter of release in 1976 - which she received but chose not to acknowledge - I no longer regarded myself as a member of the Zen Mission Society. Kennett Roshi and Daizui had written informing us that they were terminating all correspondence with us, which I felt confirmed a termination of relationship. Since I was registered with Soto Headquarters these matters were discussed when I arrived back in Japan and the procedures were followed to register the change of teachers. Kennett Roshi's teacher Suigan Yogo had affixed his seal of authority to the transfer document. Kennett Roshi found out about the transfer from her friend who had written a rather emotional letter to her with regard to a slightly different aspect (may I please be excused from elaborating here since this is about someone else's matters?) Somehow Kennett Roshi completely focused on my change of teachers and wrote the very inventive letter to Soto Headquarters. All these letters ended up with me for translation since Kennett Roshi did not seem to have someone at Shasta Abbey to do so at that point. It seems that Kennett Roshi chose to assume that I had been dishonest by not disclosing that I was her disciple and wrote to me that I had "added more lies to my collection" (I do not know what the other pre-existing lies are) and that I had caused damage thereby. In reality, there had been no fuss or "commotion" (her word). Changing teachers officially meant that I was no longer on her register and she would not be able to control matters relating to my training. Kennett Roshi did not want me to associate with friends and other monks, so I think it must have been quite difficult for her to contemplate this change of teachers. The "commotion" that she claimed my change of teachers caused existed only in her mind. Everything had been peaceful, so it is rather ironic - to the contrary of her statement - that it was her letter intended for Soto Headquarters that caused an upheaval in the sense of our decision to return to lay life just to distance ourselves from the whole matter.

Anne, I very much appreciate your comments regarding expectations in relation to teachers. I no not recall ever expecting Kennett Roshi to be perfect, or to have all the answers, or to enlighten me - but I did anticipate that she would understand to some degree what was going on inside me since she was preceding me on the path. I believe that as students we can reasonable expect our teacher to be an authentic guide who engages us with integrity, and who has our well-being at heart. When I turned up at Unpuku-ji I had been training in Karate for about 6 years and had found that although discipline was strict, there was warm guidance. This was the case with training both in South Africa and Japan. The same applied to the Rinzai monastery where my first impressions of Zen teaching and monastic practice were formed. I also recall my calligraphy teacher - whose work had been chosed for Nitten Japan Fine Arts Exhibition on more than one occasion - as a young mother whose baby was present in the classroom. These teachers all had a quiet confidence and strength, as well as humility, in common. It is perhaps unfair to make such comparisons, and I feel somewhat contrite doing so, but this is meant as an explanation of my experience with other teachers. Teachers have tremendous power and are entrusted with their students' lives, commitment, and also their faith in the teachers' methods.

One must of course examine one's own contributions to situations, and we were young - but I do not believe any of us deliberately set out to vex Kennett Roshi. All this did end up providing very intense practice through examination ...


Chisan,
Your words "Sodos I have been to in Japan were very difficult and tough, certainly pushed me to the limits ... but it was never cold hearted" describe my own experience as well. I really agree when you say one "should be attracted to the great way and not to someone's personal message", and that "the communal practice of meditation, the strength and joint discipline of a temple is something else all together ... done together led from the top." A teacher continues to practice and to learn from peers as well as students.


Josh,
Upon just re-reading the letter Kennett Roshi sent to her friend (which he had passed on to me since he could not read the English), the nature of the misinformation and the bending of facts/events is mind-boggling. Though I really do not want this thought to arise, this letter is vindictive and revengeful - this was the impression when I first read it in 1979.

I recall Kennett Roshi talking to Mokurai and myself about the precepts in a teaching session at Unpuku-ji. She stated that causing a schism in the sangha was one of the grave "sins". Unfortunately, in effect this has happened - but here we are, working this out together.


Isan,
Thank you for your comment regarding the lineage - this transmission is something treasured in my life. Yes, we all remember Kennett Roshi differently, and I am now for the first time discussing and examining it, working towards closure and harmonious integration of all the elements/aspects. For this, I am grateful to the forum and everyone so patient with this!

It is Thanksgiving weekend here and all shops are decorated with autumn leaves and pumpkins - when I looked out the window this morning the road was barely visible in the thick fog.

Gassho,
Myozen
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chisanmichaelhughes

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Sun Oct 07, 2012 4:54 pm

very thoughtfully written Myozen

I would like to add that I very often write not what I really mean..especially when communicating with Anne the sentence

The arrival of the cherry blossoms in spring always reminds me that the universe is whole and perfection itself, and misappropriate behaviour is only seen by the dualistic minds of the unenlightened

is not to be taken as gospel it is meant as a great get out and excuse you know 'All is one I can do what I want it does not matter' whereas the reality is all is one and everything matters.I do have a peculiar sense of humor

Myozen this being with Japanese contingecy whist in Unpuku-ji struck a surprising cord I was the only westerner where I was it was not a place for westerners it was too tough,some did start to arrive and I was told to mix in with them answer their questions help out, and i didn't, I did not want the role,it was fine the guest department looked after them in the normal way,they could directly experience what they had come for. Really though places like this are places for doing not explaning because the deeper explanations come from from oneself inresponse to the deeper real questions
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Anne

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Mon Oct 08, 2012 12:07 pm

ZEN DYNASTY
[This is not exactly how I imagine life in a monastery — Author]
...Having received news from an old friend abroad, as night falls Nemo Roshi muses over her former disciple Ms Z who, it seems, has signed up with another teacher in that distant land…

frown ...I remember we first met in an abandoned doghouse where she was shacked up with four other runaways, when I was seeking shelter from rain…but SHE swears we met in the village hall at a charity fund-raising event organised with four other ladies…

…I remember her sneaking off temple grounds to the sweetshop every Saturday with two cronies, for a pack of M&Ms and a bottle of Coca-Cola…but
SHE swears she was visiting the Kanzeon grotto with a bag of birdseed and water for the birdbath, and that she had two witnesses doing kinhin…

...The lies, the lies!… Then she accused
ME, ye gods! Now she has gone on to create havoc at SotoShu HQ. What gets INTO people!?!...


Idea cheers ...Upsetting her cocoa, Nemo Roshi hits upon a strategy to warn others of the renegade in their midst, and to bring home to Ms Z the error of her ways…
and to SotoShu HQ she wrote:
Dear SotoShu, I hope your new sandals are no longer chafing and that you are over the worst with the antacids. Concerning Ms Z, I first met her in a well-subscribed cathouse run with four other escaped convicts, when I was seeking shelter from rain. As my disciple, every night two bouncers from the local casino would return her to the temple, smashed and smelling of curry…[Nemo Roshi extemporises creatively]… The night sky is aglow with stars and light-pollution, and I think I’m coming down with a cold…
...Lies?...I'll show you lies, missy!!...
drunken
:-) Myozen, I do not make light of your hardships, as the above sort of stuff is no trivial or laughing matter when one is going through it. Many thanks for clarifying various points for me.

Regrettably, perhaps your ‘alternative version' of reality, presented in response to Kennett Roshi’s draft in 1974, was among your perceived 'collection of lies'; and your supplying it might also have contributed to her misperception of you.

I don’t know if/that Kennett Roshi actually had the same deliberate ‘strategy’ as the fictitious Nemo Roshi; or if simply and sadly her perceptions of you and your activities, and why you were doing them, were (unbeknown to her) very distorted, and she muddled up Kodo Sawaki’s name with that of someone else; or if, also having distorted perceptions, she didn’t care much about straight presentation as long as she got her message across, to warn others and express disapproval, and perhaps chastise you.

I do not wish to isolate Kennett Roshi, as though she is the only person who has ever acted or been affected thus. As head of the Order and abbess at Shasta, whatever misunderstandings she had about people had a wider audience, and possibly effects, than the ruminations of a more ‘private person’. Unless she was going to disband the Order (and I am very glad that she did not), she had to run it with whatever understanding or views of modi operandi she had. When I read the stories of some people on OBCC, I am reminded (perhaps it is an inappropriate parallel) of stories of the fallen or wounded from a war, and I think — I certainly hope — that their contributions and yours to the public forum of OBCC can and will help toward a greater understanding of what would keep a greater ‘peace’.

I am very glad that you also have positive sustaining memories of your time and times with Kennett Roshi. Thank you again, Myozen, for having taken the time and trouble to write again of these matters. (-:
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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Mon Oct 08, 2012 12:21 pm

VOLUNTARY CODE OF PRACTICE-

I have read with great interest the contributions here.The memories and archives help with the larger picture of the progress of buddhist culture in the west.

I am interested in,and working on, a Voluntary Code of Practice for those teachers etc who offer retreats,temples,etc.

Is anyone else interested in working on this with me?

Or does anyone not understand what I am on about?



Ikuko(as maisie field)
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chisanmichaelhughes

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PostSubject: Re: Myozen Delport   Mon Oct 08, 2012 1:04 pm

Ahh Nemo my friend, I am reminded of our relaxing time we spent together by the river in Kyoto, we enjoyed some vintage warm sake and talked of course about the genjo koan. A koan of how the normal is really the spiritual,and how our personal life and he way we live is walking in the Buddhas and patriarchs footsteps.
I remember my question to you that if one lives an 'inappropriate life' or give wrong teaching or practices a delusive path,can one instantly be released from karma and be a teacher of all beings,or does initial delusion color everything one touches,as you remained silent I respected this as zen silence rather than an ability to shout or demonstrate the answer.

Kyoto night time

Moon on water

Another sake Nemo
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